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+--- Thread: Tire pressure sensors (/showthread.php?tid=92)
RE: Tire pressure sensors - quattro4awd - 09-14-2023
over the past couple weeks I have been trying to make adjustments in OrBit in order to trigger a TPMS low pressure warning flag at a specific pressure value. I was aiming for a trigger point somewhere in the range of 32 to 35psi (220 to 240Kpa). this being based on a desired cold tire pressure setting of 38psi (260Kpa). so far I am not having any luck
![[Image: AIL4fc9a-juBp_axLOlkhdB9FeHZAoQ-3MLhCMvS...authuser=0]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw/AIL4fc9a-juBp_axLOlkhdB9FeHZAoQ-3MLhCMvSVuINJvQGz8oBO87ioZs-DyWCGZ5hxLj8HXIEJD9_kaVu1brWTxLDT0TECmvpsV-FMq0tplXA1GKsNhiZIDKPNPh4eRP1yFCU4kIrpG-WHcQ4A2ioO6qP=w1673-h941-s-no?authuser=0)
I started out with adjusting the physical tire pressure down to 34psi (234Kpa) and then going into OrBit and adjusting the "tyre pressure" config line items up from its OEM config setting of 240Kpa (all 8 line items were set to the same value originally so I adjusted all 8 values in the same manner). after changing the setting in OrBit I would drive the S60 for a couple/few days to see if the low tire pressure warning flag would popup... it didn't throw the flag. I would then go back into OrBit and adjust the values up to the next higher value (setting are in 10Kpa increments) then drive again for a couple/few days... still nothing, adjust again.. still no dice
when I bumped up the pressure values to 300Kpa the S60 balked and displayed a configuration error similar to what I received when I tried to adjust the "tyre size" line item value up to reflect my moving up from a 45 series sidewall tire to a 50 series... for me this was a bit weird, the S60 obviously did not like the manipulation of the "tyre size" setting, but it did not seem to have an issue with the adjustment up of the "tyre circumference" line item setting I was manipulating to try and reduce the speedometer error experienced after installing the taller sidewall tires
at that point I decide to change strategies, I went back in with OrBit and set all 8 of the "tyre pressure" line items to 260Kpa and then I started dropping the physical tire cold pressure setting down in 2psi (14Kpa) increments...drive the S60 a couple/few days...nothing.. drop cold tire pressure again by 2psi..drive another couple/few days.. still nothing. I decided to stop dropping cold tire pressure when I got down to 28psi (193Kpa) as that tire pressure is below the threshold of where the S60 feels planted and stable with the taller aspect ratio tires (at pressures that low the S60 feels like it is loose and wallowy...not a good feeling!)
I know the system is seeing / reading the changes in cold tire pressure as the TPMS display initially starts out with faded grey values and then becomes more white in color once it receives the readings from the sensors and the displayed values when they initially become "live" are within 1psi of what I was reading from my tire pressure gauge when I was setting the cold tire pressure.
Am I missing a setting or something here? is it possible that the TPMS low pressure flag setting is a fixed value (that is below 28psi) and cannot be adjusted? I would think that a 7psi (48Kpa) drop in pressure which is a 20% drop from the OEM cold set pressure of 35psi (240Kpa) should be enough to trigger the low pressure flag.
RE: Tire pressure sensors - quattro4awd - 09-17-2023
I guess this goes back to the old saying "third time is the charm".
![[Image: AIL4fc8NxmRwLqCi3JdvGvUVa1TQwgr2tFr0xxak...authuser=0]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw/AIL4fc8NxmRwLqCi3JdvGvUVa1TQwgr2tFr0xxak9PRFZ7-RUw9HzsN_znuFfazFQDXZxVov1Ipyyp3TtNbnoaZ4-ry62MP0nKhSKc90D2fIg6Rlu-Wxo9EPy0YVq1Bqed-BJYMLdLikxIsRFyCwESGQJXsP=w706-h941-s-no?authuser=0)
had some time to think about the issues I was having and a realization hit me... the old rule of thumb = tire pressure can grow up to 7psi (48Kpa) between a "cold" and "hot" tire.
I was riding right on the edge of triggering a TPMS low pressure flag warning but not quite far enough.
What I figured out in order to trigger and reset a TPMS warning flag:
1). the flag trigger threshold (differential pressure between the "tyre pressure" setting line item stored in the ECU and the physical tire pressure being produced by the TPMS sensor)
= 10psi (69Kpa)
2). once a low pressure flag is triggered, in order to clear / reset and turn off the warning flag
= tire pressure reading from the TPMS sensor must be raised to equal or higher than the "tyre pressure" settings stored in the ECU.
as I am not exactly sure what all is affected by the "tyre pressure" line items setting (I.E.= is it strictly for the TPMS system? or do these values actually get utilized by the steering, suspension, ABS, etc. as well?) I didn't want to have a large gap discrepancy between the ECU preset value and the physical cold tire pressure that all the wheels are set to for this reason.
so I did a compromise and the current configuration has:
1). all 4 wheels will be set to a cold tire pressure of 38psi (262Kpa)
2). all 8 "tyre pressure" line items are set to 280Kpa (approx. 40psi), this will give me a TPMS low pressure warning flag at 30psi (207Kpa)
the reasoning behind all this:
after moving to the taller 50 series sidewall tires, having tire pressures set to a cold base temp of 38psi produced the best handling responsiveness in my opinion. when all 4 tires were set to a cold pressure of 34psi (234Kpa) the S60 felt loose and wallowy in its handling. also when a single wheel's tire pressure drops down to 28psi (193Kpa) the S60 will again exhibit a loose wallowy feel.
in order to get a TPMS warning flag to trigger at 34psi where I initially wanted it to trigger, I would have to set the "tyre pressure" line items between 300Kpa (43.5psi) to 310Kpa (45psi). a previous attempt to set the "tyre pressure" line items to 300Kpa several weeks ago resulted in a configuration error being displayed. and if there are other vehicle systems that actually pull and utilize the "tyre pressure" line item set point to adjust other system settings for handling... it is probably best to keep those line item settings as close to what the actual physical tire cold pressure is set to.
RE: Tire pressure sensors - Power6 - 09-24-2023
Ha man, thanks, I think only a few special people such as yourself have the patience to test this ;-) That's good to know, you gotta be off quite a bit to trigger a warning, but I guess the purpose of the system is to...well let's be honest the purpose is to meet regulations...but the purpose of those is to prevent horrible accidents, so I'm not surprised it takes a good amount of loss to trigger the system.
The reccomended pressure on the tires is quite high, I think my door jamb has 38psi listed. And I am keeping the current 255/35/19 tires I got at 36 or so. With these or the 19" OEMs even, 235/40 you def don't get any wallowy feeling at mid 30s pressures. I can imagine on 50 series you might. I suspect part of the high pressure reccomendation is meeting the load carrying ability for max capacity, the S/V60 is pretty heavy for the tire sizes they use, I think all the OEM tires are XL load rating.
RE: Tire pressure sensors - raidewr600 - 10-04-2023
What happens if we have two sets of wheels? Would we want tpms sensors in each? What would we do if we changed wheels? Just use the calibrate button for the new set? What if we have one set of wheels with tpms and the other without? Do we just changed the config back to factory "store pressure" indirect settings?
RE: Tire pressure sensors - quattro4awd - 11-09-2023
(10-04-2023, 12:06 AM)raidewr600 Wrote: What happens if we have two sets of wheels? Would we want tpms sensors in each? What would we do if we changed wheels? Just use the calibrate button for the new set? What if we have one set of wheels with tpms and the other without? Do we just changed the config back to factory "store pressure" indirect settings?
If you are wanting to be able to display actual physical tire pressure values in the IHU display for either of the wheel/tire sets -- TPMS sensors will be required for each wheel/tire set. and when swapped -- a re-calibration of the system to update the TPMS IDs would be required. I just did this about 10 days ago; my "summer" wheel/tire set was the testbed for the TPMS sensors. I also installed TPMS sensors in my OE wheels that now are setup as the "winter" wheel/tire set.
FYI- the system will not complete a TPMS re-calibration if any of the four sensors are bad (dead) or missing (not present).
(I found out the hard way... took the S60 to discount tire and instructed them to install the TPMS sensors into the "winter" wheel/tire set and the DS lot lizards didn't install one of the sensors. tried to re-calibrate the system a couple times and after several minutes it would fail to re-calibrate... scanned the S60 with OrBit and only had three TPMS IDs. I returned to DT about an hour later and "luckily" they found my missing sensor and installed it... afterward the re-calibration sequence completed without issue.)
If you are ok with one wheel/tire set having TPMS sensors and another set running withOUT sensors, then you would need to go into orbit and reset the system back to an "indirect TPMS system" when the wheel/tire set withOUT sensors is installed to prevent the vehicle from displaying a tire pressure warning flag and vice-versa when you return to the wheel/tire set that does have TPMS sensors.
RE: Tire pressure sensors - Andrei - 11-11-2023
(10-04-2023, 12:06 AM)raidewr600 Wrote: What happens if we have two sets of wheels? Would we want tpms sensors in each? What would we do if we changed wheels? Just use the calibrate button for the new set? What if we have one set of wheels with tpms and the other without? Do we just changed the config back to factory "store pressure" indirect settings?Hello!
My car is XC 90 T6 2016.
I have original wheels 275/40r21 and they have absolute pressure sensors installed. The screen shows the pressure values:
I ride on these wheels in the summer.
For the winter I bought myself complete wheels 235/60r18. After installing the wheels, calibration was unsuccessful, and the TPMS fault icon was displayed on the driver’s screen:
Thanks to Orbit, I changed the appropriate settings and switched to an indirect pressure control system and got the following picture:
The error on the driver's screen naturally also disappeared.
Now my hands are free! When spring comes, I’ll put on summer tires and just change the system parameters!
P.S.: I like dTPMS better, so maybe I’ll buy sensors and install them in the wheels next season. In general, with Orbit you do as you like))
P.P.S Both times, after installing the wheels (I pump the pressure to 2.6 bar), I simply turn on the calibration and after 5-7 minutes of driving the system begins to show values in one case, green circles in the other.
RE: Tire pressure sensors - Liven - 02-05-2024
(04-10-2023, 04:40 PM)Power6 Wrote: I bought a set of TPMS sensors for new wheels I got in, which I will get tires for and mount soon. Have not installed yet so can't confirm myself yet. I was not going to spend those OEM prices for sensors just to play with it and confirm the swap! But at this price, why not? https://www.ebay.com/itm/303907380887
Those should be correct, for US Sensus car at least. The sensors are supported by the Sensus cars (not supported iCup/Android) and you can tell the proper frequency by the frequency of the remote fobs, which on my 2019 S60 (and I think all the US Can cars) is 433Mhz. I believe the system uses the same 3-4 keyless fob antennas in the car to receive from the sensors so you need to match if the fobs are 315 or 433. At any rate I know it's supported and I got testers who have confirmed they can add sensors and enable the sensor TPMS on Sensus Volvo.
The TPMS sensor system needs no activation action at all. The system will monitor all sensors it "hears" and work out over time which ones are on the car, and of those, which wheel location they are mounted. That does take some time. I did add the ability to see and edit sensor IDs in OrBit, on the Service Tab. This was on request of a user who wanted to reduce the time to "learn" the sensors, if you know the IDs of the mounted sensors, you can enter them in and skip the auto-learning process. The location is not shown but I think we have worked out which of the data corresponds to which wheel, if that is the case I will update the display to show the locations.
Settings are:
019 - TPMS "sensor" system config
020 - TPMS menu functions in Sensus
267 - Indirect TPMS system config
When switching from indirect to sensor system, you would change 267 to "without" to disable that, then change 019 to one of the settings to enable (I believe "WBL" is what we want, I will see if I can confirm). Then you can change the menus in the Sensus with item 020, set as you like but the relevant part is you should be able to use any config with the "show pressure" included, since the sensor system will enable that to work.
what's the difference with WBA and WBL algorithm?
RE: Tire pressure sensors - richardGG24 - 02-25-2024
Here is a tip for those who are going to use Autel MX universal sensor, instead of programming it to your specific model/year, you need to select XC90 or S90, choose the option that says "433mhz 31362304", and then program them, you don't need to plug into the OBD port. I believe this is applicable to both NA and Euro models.
If you own a S/V60, there is a 433mhz option in the Autel TPMS tool that covers up to 2021MY, I initially assumed this is the correct option, but it didn't work. After clicking the "Calibrate" button, the hamster wheel would spin for 15 to 20 minutes before showing "Calibration unsuccessful, Try again".
RE: Tire pressure sensors - glennda5id - 02-25-2024
Yea, or select 2016 XC90, which came with direct TPMS. I have Autel MX on my car.
RE: Tire pressure sensors - cholo07 - 03-21-2024
Hi
I have wheels without TPMS is it possible to delete the warning so i dont have to buy new sensors
(11-11-2023, 08:46 AM)Andrei Wrote:How did you do to get rid of the warning(10-04-2023, 12:06 AM)raidewr600 Wrote: What happens if we have two sets of wheels? Would we want tpms sensors in each? What would we do if we changed wheels? Just use the calibrate button for the new set? What if we have one set of wheels with tpms and the other without? Do we just changed the config back to factory "store pressure" indirect settings?Hello!
My car is XC 90 T6 2016.
I have original wheels 275/40r21 and they have absolute pressure sensors installed. The screen shows the pressure values:
I ride on these wheels in the summer.
For the winter I bought myself complete wheels 235/60r18. After installing the wheels, calibration was unsuccessful, and the TPMS fault icon was displayed on the driver’s screen:
Thanks to Orbit, I changed the appropriate settings and switched to an indirect pressure control system and got the following picture:
The error on the driver's screen naturally also disappeared.
Now my hands are free! When spring comes, I’ll put on summer tires and just change the system parameters!
P.S.: I like dTPMS better, so maybe I’ll buy sensors and install them in the wheels next season. In general, with Orbit you do as you like))
P.P.S Both times, after installing the wheels (I pump the pressure to 2.6 bar), I simply turn on the calibration and after 5-7 minutes of driving the system begins to show values in one case, green circles in the other.
Is it 019 and 020 you change to Without ?
see picture